Why lower rated players should learn bird's opening

The Dutch is good enough from the black side I guess, but there's no point in trying to simulate it from the white side is illogical when you consider that there are better tries for white.

Also, the Dutch and Bird's openings are not the same thing by any means, completely different due to the tempo.

Also, the fact that the OP says that you should play it to learn how to get beaten is ridiculous, just play normal, better openings and learn from those. I don't see what's so crazily good about 1.f4 besides that it's an equal game where white created an unprovoked weakness.

The Dutch and the Bird are not identical, but they are not "completely different" either. Hence, IM Watson treats both in the same chapter of his opening series.

And no one has said 1. f4 is "crazily good."

One can argue forever on whether White should press the first move advantage as hard as possible from the start or not mind particularly if the opening peters out to equality and take up the battle from there.

There are GMs who play the Colle and the London, which aren't hardest hitting openings either.

More important than an opening is how one follows is up.

Hey Birdbrain, thanks for your input.  I am going to emulate your setup for From's opening.  So far I haven't actually studied it.  I am slowly reading a book on bird's opening, but it hasn't gotten to the chapter on From's opening. 

Joe, we can play an unrated takebacks game and we can discuss ideas.  I am doing the same thing for Turbofish, with the idea of showing him different ways to approach From's Gambit.  Honestly, if you know your stuff, you can get an equal, playable position...of course, equal doesn't mean drawish, as you well know ;)

I've used bird's opening and I have won some great games with it because it allowed e to dominate the centre and checkmate my opponent because they didn't have the proper follow up moves.

I usually play d4 though since it gives both sides dynamic chances. As a response to 1.f4 I would play d5.

I have Bird's Opening as a fallback for cases where I don't feel 1. e4 is a good idea.  In my hands, barring the From Gambit, it's very similar in feel to the Dutch; most Dutch lines are not razor-sharp so the White/Black difference isn't as pressing as, say, comparing the English with the Sicilian.

Something I notice is that 27 years ago (when I was last playing seriously) people were very surprised to see it and wondered if I was taking them seriously. I played Bird's against a master last tournament and lost in the middlegame:  he didn't seem at all surprised by the opening and just played standard plans familiar from the Dutch.  I don't think there is anything wrong with playing unpopular openings as long as they are sound, and it's difficult to see how this one could be unsound (again barring the From Gambit, which is what I play as Black on the vanishingly rare occasions I face Bird's, but I don't personally think it's more than okay for Black).

The birds opening is bad, and only birds should use it. And birds don't know how to play. They only fly away like birds should do.

In all seriousness. I prefer 1. b3 then you can play f4 later and skip all these crazy gambits

You really don't want to play the King's Gambit as White unless you have prepared for it or you know your opponent is even more poorly prepared.

Aside from the ultimate questions of the KG's soundness, which I don't believe apply much to class players, the problem for White is that Black has at least four or five decent lines to play, all complicated, so the prep burden is mostly on White's side.

In my hands, barring the From Gambit, it's very similar in feel to the Dutch; most Dutch lines are not razor-sharp so the White/Black difference isn't as pressing as, say, comparing the English with the Sicilian.

WCM mkkuhner: Well said!

I'm sorry but the above kinds of positions are so wrong I can't even express it. g5 is your only shot at a half decent game and its really hard to repel.

I guess you haven't seen my win percentage against ...g5 then ;)  I have far more wins than losses against that, I would wager.  Besides, even if you follow the mainlines, White builds an enormous pawn center, and it is on Black to prove that the loss of the pawn is justified.  

With that said...I play ...g5 from time to time, as I think it is better than its credit.  It often gives Black pressure against White's position.

I'd like to see what you play against g5. Not even grandmasters can hold it. 

As a matter of fact, you are showing you don't fully understand the position, DefiledMartyr, nor your opponent.  I will show you how you could have achieved a much faster win, plus what your opponent should have done (and I have my own recipe against ...g5 as well) - 

I will even go back!  I see that a plan I kind of like instead of the early d4 has been tried in a high-caliber match, involving the Nc3-e4 plan, which I think is boss hog...

Look at 22. Rd5!  Agdestein showed he came for the win, and laid some good smack down on his opponent.  I guess we can say he gave him the Bird!

For your reference - 

https://gyazo.com/3aa4dc8e3942e1002595d7d354f0b793

...g5 has a better percentage for White than the 2nd move in choice, ...Nf6 (which is probably a much better path to immediate equality with pressure on White).

Here is a breakdown of how White handles ...g5, along with percentages:

https://gyazo.com/75f52eabcba84f4d54682f5de4565611

I am not hardly covering the d4, nor the c3 - there is a lot to this position. 

I do want to note that I am not saying ...g5 is terrible.  It is just not the end-all to meeting the Bird.

I do have a challenge for you, however.  This will be for your benefit.  

Prove to all of us why ...g5 is a surefire win for Black, with concrete evidence.  This will be instructive to you, to help you understand the positions.

thats weer wurms go dont they? birds opening?

Accepted Birdbrain, but a caveat: My proof will not be a full analysis but a rated game against yours truly. You said "prove it". I assume you mean by any means necessary. Let's see you prove that Birdbrain is sound.

That is fair, Defiled. I presume by this, you are saying that if I can survive the opening and get into the middlegame with a playable position, you will agree that the White side has merit?

I only base these concepts upon if I can survive into the middlegame with a playable position, and even more if I can play for a win with them.  

But sure thing!