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FIDE Transgender Policies

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lonniespiel
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:

Or they have more opportunities to do so?

The opposite is true: women can compete in women's tournaments and in open once, but men can't compete in women's tournaments but only in open once.

Thus, women have more opportunities to play competitive chess. 

Though a lot of women choose not to play in open events because they don't feel safe, so until FIDE address that issue, we're still going to see relatively small numbers of women at open chess tournaments.

Even if that is true, I do not see how it has any influence on the strength of women chess players.

This thread isn't about the strength of women chess players, or the war on Ukraine, though some people try to take it off topic in different directions.

I've said all along, that FIDE are targeting the easy issue of transgender in sport, which isn't an issue in chess now. But claims of sexual harassment are real, and FIDE are doing nothing about this.

Their priorities are ridiculous.

I am tired of saying the same thing:

Women are not inherently a marginalized group; rather, they deserve equal opportunities to excel. By eliminating gender-specific chess titles and exclusive women-only FIDE rated tournaments, we can pave the way for genuine equality. That will fix transgender issue as well right away. Full stop

Then stop saying it. I answered you once already

Ok, we are on the same page, next question

Err, I don't think so, but you like to obfuscate and then back down, which is fair enough I suppose

"but you like to obfuscate and then back down" - when did I do that? 

You brought up Ukraine and then backed down, and you haven't answered my posts about women's participation, but made a flip comment about me agreeing with you.

Do you speak English, or do you use translator?

More obfuscation?

Not at all; I was very clear with my answers, but you have a hard time comprehending, so I am troubleshooting

Clear as mud. I tell you what, I'll repeat what I said earlier which you ignored before:

lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:

Women sexually abuse other women/girls as well

Of course, and men abuse men/boys. But women in chess want a safe environment essentially from men, and for the moment that means they want exclusively women only spaces. They're the victims, so I'm happy to listen to what they're saying

They can play among each other, just not in official tournaments and they should not get any W titles. Problem solved

Let's take away the few scraps we've thrown their way?

I thought the idea was to attract more women to the game?

How about me and you give up telling women what's best for them, and instead listen to them and help to accommodate and include them?

So, you are using translator ... you should use a different one, because my answer was clear and to the point.

You didn't answer this. Not sure what your agenda is in this thread other than taking things off topic. Anyway, bye......

Coddiwompler
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:

Or they have more opportunities to do so?

The opposite is true: women can compete in women's tournaments and in open once, but men can't compete in women's tournaments but only in open once.

Thus, women have more opportunities to play competitive chess. 

Though a lot of women choose not to play in open events because they don't feel safe, so until FIDE address that issue, we're still going to see relatively small numbers of women at open chess tournaments.

Even if that is true, I do not see how it has any influence on the strength of women chess players.

This thread isn't about the strength of women chess players, or the war on Ukraine, though some people try to take it off topic in different directions.

I've said all along, that FIDE are targeting the easy issue of transgender in sport, which isn't an issue in chess now. But claims of sexual harassment are real, and FIDE are doing nothing about this.

Their priorities are ridiculous.

I am tired of saying the same thing:

Women are not inherently a marginalized group; rather, they deserve equal opportunities to excel. By eliminating gender-specific chess titles and exclusive women-only FIDE rated tournaments, we can pave the way for genuine equality. That will fix transgender issue as well right away. Full stop

Then stop saying it. I answered you once already

Ok, we are on the same page, next question

Err, I don't think so, but you like to obfuscate and then back down, which is fair enough I suppose

"but you like to obfuscate and then back down" - when did I do that? 

You brought up Ukraine and then backed down, and you haven't answered my posts about women's participation, but made a flip comment about me agreeing with you.

Do you speak English, or do you use translator?

More obfuscation?

Not at all; I was very clear with my answers, but you have a hard time comprehending, so I am troubleshooting

Clear as mud. I tell you what, I'll repeat what I said earlier which you ignored before:

lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:

Women sexually abuse other women/girls as well

Of course, and men abuse men/boys. But women in chess want a safe environment essentially from men, and for the moment that means they want exclusively women only spaces. They're the victims, so I'm happy to listen to what they're saying

They can play among each other, just not in official tournaments and they should not get any W titles. Problem solved

Let's take away the few scraps we've thrown their way?

I thought the idea was to attract more women to the game?

How about me and you give up telling women what's best for them, and instead listen to them and help to accommodate and include them?

So, you are using translator ... you should use a different one, because my answer was clear and to the point.

You didn't answer this. Not sure what your agenda is in this thread other than taking things off topic. Anyway, bye......

They can play among each other - they can feel safe.

just not in official tournaments and they should not get any W titles. - equality above all else

Problem solved

They can also play online, there are still no women or transgenders among top online players 

It is late here, good night 

Thooraki
AngryPuffer wrote:
Botvinnik_the_6th wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:
Botvinnik_the_6th wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:
Botvinnik_the_6th wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:
Botvinnik_the_6th wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:

trans women are not real women and are playing make-believe and pretend. similar to how 7 year olds play cowboys and indians or whatever...

The current scientific consensus is that Gender dysphoria is real.

how. if you have XY then you are male and if you have XX then you are female

nothing can disprove that. its simple biology

Sex and gender are defined differently.

gender is literally defined as "the male and female sex"

The google definition you took that from but didn't read: "the male sex or the female sex, especially when considered with reference to social and cultural differences rather than biological ones, or one of a range of other identities that do not correspond to established ideas of male and female."
Literally defined by the social and cultural implications over biological ones.

Nice one! That's a quote commonly misattributed to Lenin but that he didn't actually say. Either way it's a stupid point because gender and sex are two different terms that are defined differently by researchers and scientists and I sincerely doubt you have any qualifications in this area.

i know

Yeah, Goebbels would also probably agree with your views on transgender people!

Thooraki
Badchesserrr4486999 wrote:
Botvinnik_the_6th написал:
AngryPuffer wrote:
Botvinnik_the_6th wrote:
Badchesserrr4486999 wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 написал:

And anyway, what harm do we actually cause? What 'proof' is there that trans women have a "biological advantage" in chess? Or are in any way harmful to women in general?

Idk i just honestly dislike trans people

So you're just a bigot then

he has a right to express an opinion

there is also nothing wrong with dis agreeing with trans people. i and most people do aswell

stop being a bot and using the "bigot word" like all the only ultra woke people do

Definition of a bigot; "a person who is obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief, opinion, or faction, especially one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic towards a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group."
It's not "disagreeing" with trans people. They said they "dislike trans people". It fits the literal definition of the term.

idk i just dislike trans people, they dont make any sense.

Instead of disliking them for not understanding them, you could just not give a damn and let them be.

Thooraki
whisper2016 wrote:
AhmedAryan wrote:
whisper2016 wrote:
AhmedAryan wrote:
whisper2016 wrote:
Botvinnik_the_6th wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:
Badchesserrr4486999 wrote:
Kyobir написал:

What if there was a separate category for them?

What if people never wanted to be trans and everyone would benefit?

Doesn't work that way, being trans is not a choice, just like being gay is not a choice, and being left handed is not a choice.

it is

pretending to be a girl is your choice

likeing men is different

being left handed is a choice

Being trans is not "pretending to be a girl". How many trans people do you actually know? How many women do you actually know?

i dont interact with trans people ive just seen enough to determine that they are mentally ill

"I've not met any trans people, I've just assumed they're all mentally ill." - such a nice perspective.

"I've not met a murderer yet, therefore I cannot have an opinion on murder." Logic 100

"I haven't seen a murder yet, therefore I cannot have an opinion on murderers."

two can play at that game

Exactly

that kind of logic is stupid

"I've not met a murderer yet, therefore I cannot have an opinion on murder."

"I haven't seen a murder yet, therefore I cannot have an opinion on murderers."

murder here is a bit of a stretch but it applies to people

you know enough about murders and murderers that you can assume and be right mostly but for trans knowing not much and assuming they're mentally ill you can see the problem here

The OP was claiming that angrypuffers opinion was invalid because he has never met a trans person

thats like claiming that formulating an opinion on the Holocaust requires a meeting with NeoNazis

324 messages until godwin's law has been realised. Well done everyone, better than I expected.

Thooraki
AngryPuffer wrote:
Botvinnik_the_6th wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:

your momentum is gone now. you just sound stupid

I would think that the person who struggles to understand basic statistics and basic definitions is the one sounding stupid.

Fun fact, lobsters are smarter than pufferfish

AngryPuffer
Thooraki wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:
Botvinnik_the_6th wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:

your momentum is gone now. you just sound stupid

I would think that the person who struggles to understand basic statistics and basic definitions is the one sounding stupid.

Fun fact, lobsters are smarter than pufferfish

grouper

lonniespiel
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:

Or they have more opportunities to do so?

The opposite is true: women can compete in women's tournaments and in open once, but men can't compete in women's tournaments but only in open once.

Thus, women have more opportunities to play competitive chess. 

Though a lot of women choose not to play in open events because they don't feel safe, so until FIDE address that issue, we're still going to see relatively small numbers of women at open chess tournaments.

Even if that is true, I do not see how it has any influence on the strength of women chess players.

This thread isn't about the strength of women chess players, or the war on Ukraine, though some people try to take it off topic in different directions.

I've said all along, that FIDE are targeting the easy issue of transgender in sport, which isn't an issue in chess now. But claims of sexual harassment are real, and FIDE are doing nothing about this.

Their priorities are ridiculous.

I am tired of saying the same thing:

Women are not inherently a marginalized group; rather, they deserve equal opportunities to excel. By eliminating gender-specific chess titles and exclusive women-only FIDE rated tournaments, we can pave the way for genuine equality. That will fix transgender issue as well right away. Full stop

Then stop saying it. I answered you once already

Ok, we are on the same page, next question

Err, I don't think so, but you like to obfuscate and then back down, which is fair enough I suppose

"but you like to obfuscate and then back down" - when did I do that? 

You brought up Ukraine and then backed down, and you haven't answered my posts about women's participation, but made a flip comment about me agreeing with you.

Do you speak English, or do you use translator?

More obfuscation?

Not at all; I was very clear with my answers, but you have a hard time comprehending, so I am troubleshooting

Clear as mud. I tell you what, I'll repeat what I said earlier which you ignored before:

lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:

Women sexually abuse other women/girls as well

Of course, and men abuse men/boys. But women in chess want a safe environment essentially from men, and for the moment that means they want exclusively women only spaces. They're the victims, so I'm happy to listen to what they're saying

They can play among each other, just not in official tournaments and they should not get any W titles. Problem solved

Let's take away the few scraps we've thrown their way?

I thought the idea was to attract more women to the game?

How about me and you give up telling women what's best for them, and instead listen to them and help to accommodate and include them?

So, you are using translator ... you should use a different one, because my answer was clear and to the point.

You didn't answer this. Not sure what your agenda is in this thread other than taking things off topic. Anyway, bye......

They can play among each other - they can feel safe.

just not in official tournaments and they should not get any W titles. - equality above all else

Problem solved

They can also play online, there are still no women or transgenders among top online players 

It is late here, good night 

I think it must be late where you are because you are reversing the order of the posts. You are answering my question with the post I was asking about.

I would say it's been fun debating, but to be honest, it's been tedious. Anyways, feel free to answer but I'm giving up answering your blather.

Coddiwompler
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:

Or they have more opportunities to do so?

The opposite is true: women can compete in women's tournaments and in open once, but men can't compete in women's tournaments but only in open once.

Thus, women have more opportunities to play competitive chess. 

Though a lot of women choose not to play in open events because they don't feel safe, so until FIDE address that issue, we're still going to see relatively small numbers of women at open chess tournaments.

Even if that is true, I do not see how it has any influence on the strength of women chess players.

This thread isn't about the strength of women chess players, or the war on Ukraine, though some people try to take it off topic in different directions.

I've said all along, that FIDE are targeting the easy issue of transgender in sport, which isn't an issue in chess now. But claims of sexual harassment are real, and FIDE are doing nothing about this.

Their priorities are ridiculous.

I am tired of saying the same thing:

Women are not inherently a marginalized group; rather, they deserve equal opportunities to excel. By eliminating gender-specific chess titles and exclusive women-only FIDE rated tournaments, we can pave the way for genuine equality. That will fix transgender issue as well right away. Full stop

Then stop saying it. I answered you once already

Ok, we are on the same page, next question

Err, I don't think so, but you like to obfuscate and then back down, which is fair enough I suppose

"but you like to obfuscate and then back down" - when did I do that? 

You brought up Ukraine and then backed down, and you haven't answered my posts about women's participation, but made a flip comment about me agreeing with you.

Do you speak English, or do you use translator?

More obfuscation?

Not at all; I was very clear with my answers, but you have a hard time comprehending, so I am troubleshooting

Clear as mud. I tell you what, I'll repeat what I said earlier which you ignored before:

lonniespiel wrote:
Coddiwompler wrote:

Women sexually abuse other women/girls as well

Of course, and men abuse men/boys. But women in chess want a safe environment essentially from men, and for the moment that means they want exclusively women only spaces. They're the victims, so I'm happy to listen to what they're saying

They can play among each other, just not in official tournaments and they should not get any W titles. Problem solved

Let's take away the few scraps we've thrown their way?

I thought the idea was to attract more women to the game?

How about me and you give up telling women what's best for them, and instead listen to them and help to accommodate and include them?

So, you are using translator ... you should use a different one, because my answer was clear and to the point.

You didn't answer this. Not sure what your agenda is in this thread other than taking things off topic. Anyway, bye......

They can play among each other - they can feel safe.

just not in official tournaments and they should not get any W titles. - equality above all else

Problem solved

They can also play online, there are still no women or transgenders among top online players 

It is late here, good night 

I think it must be late where you are because you are reversing the order of the posts. You are answering my question with the post I was asking about.

I would say it's been fun debating, but to be honest, it's been tedious. Anyways, feel free to answer but I'm giving up answering your blather.

it is not my responsibility to understand for you.

badger_song

it is not my responsibility to understand for you.

True---but it it is your responsibility to make yourself understandable. You are trolling, and this is a troll-thread. It is the latest iteration of a long line of bigotry threads in the forums. You are not a friend of progress or fairness, just another bigot trolling the forums. The chess forums are full of haters, gender-politics has been very popular recently, you aren't the first ant-progressive in the forums and you certainly won't be the last.

BTW I think I answered your previous question question from #361.--Your position is ridiculous, and no, I don't agree with you.

Coddiwompler
badger_song wrote:

it is not my responsibility to understand for you.

True---but it it is your responsibility to make yourself understandable. You are trolling, and this is a troll-thread. It is the latest iteration of a long line of bigotry threads in the forums. You are not a friend of progress or fairness, just another bigot trolling the forums. The chess forums are full of haters, gender-politics has been very popular recently, you aren't the first ant-progressive in the forums and you certainly won't be the last.

BTW I think I answered your previous question question from #361.--Your position is ridiculous, and no, I don't agree with you.

Why do you disagree with me?

NotMagnusCarlesn

ok, i'm not saying that men are better then women in chess or that women are dumb, but think of it this way. The top women player in the world has less elo than magnus, so magnus could say he was trans, and then farm elo in the women's world cup. so that's basically the policy

lonniespiel
NotMagnusCarlesn wrote:

ok, i'm not saying that men are better then women in chess or that women are dumb, but think of it this way. The top women player in the world has less elo than magnus, so magnus could say he was trans, and then farm elo in the women's world cup. so that's basically the policy

No, Magnus can't just say he is trans. There is a process for transitioning which takes on average 2-3 years including medical procedures and psychological evaluations. Then you have to be legally recognised by the law which not all countries do.

FIDE and bigots are scaremongering. It's not an issue in chess

Kyobir

How about we ask FIDD (Fédération internationale des dames, International Checkers Federation) what they're doing

badger_song

Another thread setting the world right..

Syntax_Error_64
NotMagnusCarlesn wrote:

ok, i'm not saying that men are better then women in chess or that women are dumb, but think of it this way. The top women player in the world has less elo than magnus, so magnus could say he was trans, and then farm elo in the women's world cup. so that's basically the policy

There is a lot more involved than just "saying your trans". Coming out is a horrible, difficult thing, and can lead to permanent separation from loved ones. No sane person would fake that just to "farm Elo in the Women's World Cup".

Syntax_Error_64
PIaneswalker wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:
NotMagnusCarlesn wrote:

ok, i'm not saying that men are better then women in chess or that women are dumb, but think of it this way. The top women player in the world has less elo than magnus, so magnus could say he was trans, and then farm elo in the women's world cup. so that's basically the policy

There is a lot more involved than just "saying your trans". Coming out is a horrible, difficult thing, and can lead to permanent separation from loved ones. No sane person would fake that just to "farm Elo in the Women's World Cup".

I disagree. With all of the cheating scandals running around, who's to say that someone won't transition just to "farm Elo in the Women's World Cup"?

I think you massively underestimate how hard transitioning is

Coddiwompler
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:
PIaneswalker wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:
NotMagnusCarlesn wrote:

ok, i'm not saying that men are better then women in chess or that women are dumb, but think of it this way. The top women player in the world has less elo than magnus, so magnus could say he was trans, and then farm elo in the women's world cup. so that's basically the policy

There is a lot more involved than just "saying your trans". Coming out is a horrible, difficult thing, and can lead to permanent separation from loved ones. No sane person would fake that just to "farm Elo in the Women's World Cup".

I disagree. With all of the cheating scandals running around, who's to say that someone won't transition just to "farm Elo in the Women's World Cup"?

I think you massively underestimate how hard transitioning is

Do you?

lonniespiel
PIaneswalker wrote:
Syntax_Error_64 wrote:
NotMagnusCarlesn wrote:

ok, i'm not saying that men are better then women in chess or that women are dumb, but think of it this way. The top women player in the world has less elo than magnus, so magnus could say he was trans, and then farm elo in the women's world cup. so that's basically the policy

There is a lot more involved than just "saying your trans". Coming out is a horrible, difficult thing, and can lead to permanent separation from loved ones. No sane person would fake that just to "farm Elo in the Women's World Cup".

I disagree. With all of the cheating scandals running around, who's to say that someone won't transition just to "farm Elo in the Women's World Cup"?

Good point.

So why don't FIDE deal with the cheating scandals? Maybe because it's easier to make up an imaginary scenario against a minority target?

badger_song

Coddi----Shouldn't you be starting another thread for bigots ?

This forum topic has been locked